Quitting the game due to unhelpful, rude, and poor staff

[Ranon]

Hello,
Although I got temporarily banned from Aries due to "botting" and could have just waited out the ban, I refused.
I'm innocent. I haven't botted in any game or downloaded any kind of program.
The main issue here was the Staff. After playing so long since 2016, I had my first issue, and it was me being wrongfully banned.
Spyro, the HEAD gamemaster would not look into my appeal or be supportive at all. I was being helped more by a person on discord called
"Abyss the lifesaver".
The poor staff in this server will be causing me to quit, along with a few of my friends who were supporting with money through donations.
Spyro needs to be checked as head gamemaster for future players. I wish I had gotten the right support, and friendly support rather than the rude, nonsupport, from the lazy head game master called Spyro.

 

[Alex]

If you were banned for botting then you were banned for botting....?

What's there to look into?

 

[makemereport]

I disagree. I play everyday in fear that I will get autobanned. Anyone with an unstable internet connection / non-perfect computer probably feels the same way. It just takes one small moment of misfortune to be banned for 7days for botting. The anti-bot system might be needed to solve the bots issue, but it's definitely comprimising on player experience. And on 2nd strike, a perma ban + ip ban.

It's not a matter of IF, it's a matter of when. If i'm to grind to 275 with my 4year old PC that blue screens once every 3.5hours, the chances of me blue screening when a bot check pops up is not negligible. I've had my kanna blocked for 7 days which I use for self kishin which is on an even 7year old laptop. I choose to recreate a kanna to self kishin than risk 2nd striking. That's how scary it is.

The fact that the bot check appears randomly when you kill mobs and not based on how repetitive your key presses are, and EVERY single LEGIT PLAYER who has grinded has faced it, will show that there is definitely a high % of false convictions. It's honestly a big issue to me that nobody is pointing out until they get affected.

 

[Justin]

alot of people be getting wrongfully banned for "botting" especially demon slayers with macros who just hold down a button while watching tv. shame.

 

[daniel66]

I got banned twice (wrongfully) for "botting" a couple of months ago on my kanna, but since then i stopped using my kanna and luckily never got banned again.
Their system is definitely broken and I get where you are coming from. I thought about quitting too, but I just waited the ban and now i have progressed alot in the game.

 

[Eki]

Hello,
Although I got temporarily banned from Aries due to "botting" and could have just waited out the ban, I refused.
I'm innocent. I haven't botted in any game or downloaded any kind of program.
The main issue here was the Staff. After playing so long since 2016, I had my first issue, and it was me being wrongfully banned.
Spyro, the HEAD gamemaster would not look into my appeal or be supportive at all. I was being helped more by a person on discord called
"Abyss the lifesaver".
The poor staff in this server will be causing me to quit, along with a few of my friends who were supporting with money through donations.
Spyro needs to be checked as head gamemaster for future players. I wish I had gotten the right support, and friendly support rather than the rude, nonsupport, from the lazy head game master called Spyro.

Mistakes on our end do happen and we look into every appeal that comes to our attention weather you want to believe it or not is up to you. I've read over your appeal and I would come have to the same conclusion as Spyro given your situation seems highly unlikely cause our system won't even give you a test if you were not attacking. Furthermore people who provide enough evidence to their case do most certainly get un-banned if we are in the wrong, here is an example HERE.

Unfortunately if you still do still decide to leave I wish you the best of luck in your endeavors and hope you find something else to fill your spare time with joy.

I disagree. I play everyday in fear that I will get autobanned. Anyone with an unstable internet connection / non-perfect computer probably feels the same way. It just takes one small moment of misfortune to be banned for 7days for botting. The anti-bot system might be needed to solve the bots issue, but it's definitely comprimising on player experience. And on 2nd strike, a perma ban + ip ban.

It's not a matter of IF, it's a matter of when. If i'm to grind to 275 with my 4year old PC that blue screens once every 3.5hours, the chances of me blue screening when a bot check pops up is not negligible. I've had my kanna blocked for 7 days which I use for self kishin which is on an even 7year old laptop. I choose to recreate a kanna to self kishin than risk 2nd striking. That's how scary it is.

The fact that the bot check appears randomly when you kill mobs and not based on how repetitive your key presses are, and EVERY single LEGIT PLAYER who has grinded has faced it, will show that there is definitely a high % of false convictions. It's honestly a big issue to me that nobody is pointing out until they get affected.

We do take into consideration that not everyone has perfect internet or is not located near our server resulting in unfavorable ping and Spyro has helped me in the past with looking over evidence to figure out if the player was lagging or hacking / botting.

Recently our Botting section in the ToS was modified to make the server healthier as we went through many discussions among the team and decided that 2 chances is plenty. If you were banned because your attention was on a show/movie/youtube whatever you may be doing on the side should not be put on us because 1 minute is more than enough time to look over and answer the bot test. I'm going to use KMS (Korean MapleStory) for an example because they've implemented a system where every 1~2 hours you're given a captcha in Korean to verify that "you're Korean" and not botting. If you were to get a blue screen and fail their automated test I can almost guarantee they would give you the same response as it is your fault. You should also look into getting a new system because I don't know how you get anything done with receiving a blue screen every 3.5 hours.

I would appreciate if you could elaborate why it's such a hassle to type in a 5 letter captcha every 1~2 hours. There is no "perfect system" to prevent a test going towards botters and leaving the legit players untouched although we wish there was because you're not the only person who wants to have justice towards players who abuse the system.

I got banned twice (wrongfully) for "botting" a couple of months ago on my kanna, but since then i stopped using my kanna and luckily never got banned again.
Their system is definitely broken and I get where you are coming from. I thought about quitting too, but I just waited the ban and now i have progressed alot in the game.

Spamming kishin will result in a bot test and I don't see that as a flaw, I've kishend for friends multiple times without getting a single bot test by pressing kishin every 2 minutes.

 

[daniel66]

Spamming kishin will result in a bot test and I don't see that as a flaw, I've kishend for friends multiple times without getting a single bot test by pressing kishin every 2 minutes.

Thing is I never got the "bot test", I tried explaining it to Spyro but he instantly assumed I was botting and dismissed my case. (I dont think he even thought about the possibility that the system is broken).

 

[makemereport]

We do take into consideration that not everyone has perfect internet or is not located near our server resulting in unfavorable ping and Spyro has helped me in the past with looking over evidence to figure out if the player was lagging or hacking / botting.

Recently our Botting section in the ToS was modified to make the server healthier as we went through many discussions among the team and decided that 2 chances is plenty. If you were banned because your attention was on a show/movie/youtube whatever you may be doing on the side should not be put on us because 1 minute is more than enough time to look over and answer the bot test. I'm going to use KMS (Korean MapleStory) for an example because they've implemented a system where every 1~2 hours you're given a captcha in Korean to verify that "you're Korean" and not botting. If you were to get a blue screen and fail their automated test I can almost guarantee they would give you the same response as it is your fault. You should also look into getting a new system because I don't know how you get anything done with receiving a blue screen every 3.5 hours.

I would appreciate if you could elaborate why it's such a hassle to type in a 5 letter captcha every 1~2 hours. There is no "perfect system" to prevent a test going towards botters and leaving the legit players untouched although we wish there was because you're not the only person who wants to have justice towards players who abuse the system.
.

Thank you for your response, it's very heartening to receive active support and it's one of the good things about this server . Yes it's definitely my fault for failing the test and for having a faulty PC. But I'm not cheating and I'm getting punished for it. I'm part of the unintended casualties of the anti-bot system. I have a suggestion for an easy solution. I think having a clause whereby any player banned for botting, who creates a ban appeal thread within 15 or 30minutes of the ban ( the forum email verification system is very wonky, or we could go to 15mins) , gets his ban lifted. (easy to verify since we have to post an image of the ban message as well )

Why so? The whole intention of the anti-botting system is to kill those bots, not actual players who left their passive skills on to read a guide online or take a shit in the toilet. These are really all the unintended casualties of the system. I do believe the headmaster and yourself do not intend to punish your players for having a poor computer too right? If we failed a test and tried to relogin it and realise we indeed got hit, we can prove our innoncence by posting a ban appeal thread immediately. I think that is pretty good evidence of us not botting. Botting is afterall , in the tos, the use of 3rd party programs or other methods to simulate attack movements. This clause would go a long way to give players an ease of mind that if they are legitimate, they will be safe.

The issue is not that it's a great hassle to type the captcha, it's the consequence of what happens if we fail to do so, which is far too harsh with 0 recourse. I have to point out that in the other threads in discussion, which you might have already read and looked through, top players are resorting to video recording /nvidia shadowplay their computers ,while playing ARIESMS. Many of us value our accounts and our playtime on this server, but I think it's ABSOLUTELY ABSURD that legitimate players have to resort to such methods to ensure they do not get banned by a disconnection or freak accident.

I repeat , currently there is 0 recourse for players banned by the anti-bot even with good evidence that the player created a thread within 10minutes of the ban, which is somewhat of a very good proof he wasn't automating / botting and was right at his pc, the appeal will still be denied. I do think that needs to be relooked at.

 

[PlatRedditAccount]

The main issue here was the Staff. After playing so long since 2016, I had my first issue, and it was me being wrongfully banned.
Spyro, the HEAD gamemaster would not look into my appeal or be supportive at all. I was being helped more by a person on discord called
"Abyss the lifesaver".

Henlo, it's me "Abyss the Lifesaver"
Just thought i would help to clear up some misconceptions regarding well, everything going on. Long message ahead, so brace yourselves.

We do take into consideration that not everyone has perfect internet or is not located near our server resulting in unfavorable ping and Spyro has helped me in the past with looking over evidence to figure out if the player was lagging or hacking / botting.

I've been around for a good 2.5 years, and honestly i can tell you, that the staff team do not ban w/o SOLID evidence that the person was hacking / botting.
Furthermore, the GM's themselves have legit accounts that they do play on, so you can rest assured that they aren't in anyway spared a bot check or can bend the rules to their liking.

But I'm not cheating and I'm getting punished for it. I'm part of the unintended casualties of the anti-bot system.

Unfortunately, as Eki said, there is really no perfect system in place with regards to this. However, i can tell you that if the system logs are "plausibly wrong" the person who got banned will definitely be unbanned.
Some examples of which are;
https://elluel.net/index.php?threads/ban-appeal.6388/#post-21096
https://elluel.net/index.php?threads/xtopramen-ban-appeal.7451/
Proof that admin's check System logs when processing appeals
https://elluel.net/index.php?threads/arrogantes-ban-appeal.7526/

The whole intention of the anti-botting system is to kill those bots, not actual players who left their passive skills on to read a guide online or take a shit in the toilet.

Unfortunately, i have to correct you regarding this.
By and large, botting is a huge topic that encompasses several different ways. One of said-ways is actually afk-farming.
That is to say, leaving a summon out while you alt-tab to read a guide or watch YouTube, or even if you need to go to the washroom. As long as you are "farming" without physically being there, you are presumed to be afk-farming.
Take note that keyweighting is also considered as a form of botting, despite the person physically pressing the button with his finger.

which is far too harsh with 0 recourse.

You've actually already stated a way of recourse, Nvidia ShadowPlay.
Also as i said above, the admins check System logs. if the System logs are plausibly wrong and the player has proof (Nvidia Shadowplay)
Then the staff team will do the necessary.

I repeat , currently there is 0 recourse for players banned by the anti-bot even with good evidence that the player created a thread within 10minutes of the ban, which is somewhat of a very good proof he wasn't automating / botting and was right at his pc, the appeal will still be denied. I do think that needs to be relooked at.

I'm sorry but i disagree with this. Some players bot and stay at their computer. In case you haven't noticed but whenever there's a "event" in Maple, your Maple icon will actually flash orange. This "event" could be you dc'ing, or getting kicked off the server, or several other reasons.
If for argument sake, the system logs show "i was botting" but i created my ban appeal within 10 minutes, does that means i wasn't botting?

Once again, i'm not trying to tear down your suggestion or argue that the anti-bot system is bad, but it's a necessary evil in this case.
Also, the only reason i'm actually sitting down to explain everything out is also because i was once in your shoes feeling "this bot test is stupid & so if i get banned by system, i'm screwed"
I hope you can understand why the staff team implement the bot check. If you're unsure of anything, feel free to ping me on Aries Discord so we can discuss it, or speak to Eki/Spyro regarding it.
I hope i've managed to give you a clearer understanding behind the botcheck and why it exists, and why it isn't going away anytime soon.

 

[makemereport]

Unfortunately, i have to correct you regarding this.
By and large, botting is a huge topic that encompasses several different ways. One of said-ways is actually afk-farming.
That is to say, leaving a summon out while you alt-tab to read a guide or watch YouTube, or even if you need to go to the washroom. As long as you are "farming" without physically being there, you are presumed to be afk-farming.
Take note that keyweighting is also considered as a form of botting, despite the person physically pressing the button with his finger.

You've actually already stated a way of recourse, Nvidia ShadowPlay.
Also as i said above, the admins check System logs. if the System logs are plausibly wrong and the player has proof (Nvidia Shadowplay)
Then the staff team will do the necessary.

I'm sorry but i disagree with this. Some players bot and stay at their computer. In case you haven't noticed but whenever there's a "event" in Maple, your Maple icon will actually flash orange. This "event" could be you dc'ing, or getting kicked off the server, or several other reasons.
If for argument sake, the system logs show "i was botting" but i created my ban appeal within 10 minutes, does that means i wasn't botting?

Once again, i'm not trying to tear down your suggestion or argue that the anti-bot system is bad, but it's a necessary evil in this case.
Also, the only reason i'm actually sitting down to explain everything out is also because i was once in your shoes feeling "this bot test is stupid & so if i get banned by system, i'm screwed"
I hope you can understand why the staff team implement the bot check. If you're unsure of anything, feel free to ping me on Aries Discord so we can discuss it, or speak to Eki/Spyro regarding it.
I hope i've managed to give you a clearer understanding behind the botcheck and why it exists, and why it isn't going away anytime soon.

Your whole point seems to revolve around the idea that the tos was changed in a constructive and positive way to enhance the gameplay of the community and the playerbase, which is definitely not true as I believe many players casual or hardcore do FEAR the captcha when they are 100% legitimate players.

Please explain to me, how does AFK-Farming with a passive skill impact the economy or the game in a negative way? Unless you can show me a method that rakes in over 200m/hour doing this, i will outright call it a non-issue. If so, then who would do AFK farming to earn a paltry 200m/hour whilst needing to be infront of your PC and doing it on PURPOSE knowing that it's banworthy? Lets not speak like we do not possess common sense. Nobody sane would try this. Lets say they do, should we even be bothered about them? I don't think they impact the economy at all. With the entry player being able to farm 3-4b/hour from monster park, a person afk-ing for 24hours only injects 4.8b mesos into the economy. It really doesn't negatively affect the gameplay at all, and should they be afk for a long time, players can still report them should they find them doing it. Furthermore, the point is that a player should be banned if they are abusing bots/ methods to get income without being at their PC. If they are at their PC, they should be let off. Who stays infront of their PC for long durations of time to earn a paltry 200m/hour? (which is not even possible btw unless you possess crazy gear or afk with pvac on which then makes the income either negligible to you or resulting in net loss)

The anti-bot system , in my humble opinion, is meant to rid of actual hackers who use 3rd party macros to farm maps for long periods at a time whilst not being at their pc. This is lucrative because they can have income without putting in effort, and can be detrimental to the game economy if left unchecked. THESE are the people who are outright botting and cheating. These people farm hundreds of stacks of cube and millions of NX and they should be the target of these checks and will still be equally punished even if the appeal clause is added.

I'm not saying the botcheck is not needed. It's the harshness in the consequences that the players have no way to seek recourse. Just look at all the resolved threads in technical right now, over 80% of them are denied with posts being made within 30minutes of the ban. I honestly believe all of them are somewhat innocent and are not even the main culprits the botcheck is meant to target. Having to video record your gameplay all the time whilst mapling is a totally absurd way which I do not accept as viable. This is a casual maplestory private server. We should not be getting afraid of being banned whilst being 100% legit. Anti bot systems are a necessary evil. Having these many innocent casualties is not.

The botcheck doesn't have to go. The appeal system is the one that definitely needs work. Claiming that all bans are looked into is a definite untruth. I've not seen a thread where a player got their appeal successful for a botting ban. AriesMS has been successful for a long time, but issues like this can easily blow up when it happens and snowballs. I hope the headmasters can seriously look into a way where appeals are more thoroughly looked at, and whether there is a need to ban players over something trivial just because you can edit the ToS and make your job easier than finding a way to actually help the players with the issues.

The day that legitimate players no longer fear to be banned for not cheating is the day the system is fine. No justice system in the world convicts the innocent and calls it a necessary evil. There are definitely ways we can go about to improve the situation.

 

[hysundrache]

alright goodbye i guess

 

[Spyro]

Your whole point seems to revolve around the idea that the tos was changed in a constructive and positive way to enhance the gameplay of the community and the playerbase, which is definitely not true as I believe many players casual or hardcore do FEAR the captcha when they are 100% legitimate players.

Please explain to me, how does AFK-Farming with a passive skill impact the economy or the game in a negative way? Unless you can show me a method that rakes in over 200m/hour doing this, i will outright call it a non-issue. If so, then who would do AFK farming to earn a paltry 200m/hour whilst needing to be infront of your PC and doing it on PURPOSE knowing that it's banworthy? Lets not speak like we do not possess common sense. Nobody sane would try this. Lets say they do, should we even be bothered about them? I don't think they impact the economy at all. With the entry player being able to farm 3-4b/hour from monster park, a person afk-ing for 24hours only injects 4.8b mesos into the economy. It really doesn't negatively affect the gameplay at all, and should they be afk for a long time, players can still report them should they find them doing it. Furthermore, the point is that a player should be banned if they are abusing bots/ methods to get income without being at their PC. If they are at their PC, they should be let off. Who stays infront of their PC for long durations of time to earn a paltry 200m/hour? (which is not even possible btw unless you possess crazy gear or afk with pvac on which then makes the income either negligible to you or resulting in net loss)

The anti-bot system , in my humble opinion, is meant to rid of actual hackers who use 3rd party macros to farm maps for long periods at a time whilst not being at their pc. This is lucrative because they can have income without putting in effort, and can be detrimental to the game economy if left unchecked. THESE are the people who are outright botting and cheating. These people farm hundreds of stacks of cube and millions of NX and they should be the target of these checks and will still be equally punished even if the appeal clause is added.

I'm not saying the botcheck is not needed. It's the harshness in the consequences that the players have no way to seek recourse. Just look at all the resolved threads in technical right now, over 80% of them are denied with posts being made within 30minutes of the ban. I honestly believe all of them are somewhat innocent and are not even the main culprits the botcheck is meant to target. Having to video record your gameplay all the time whilst mapling is a totally absurd way which I do not accept as viable. This is a casual maplestory private server. We should not be getting afraid of being banned whilst being 100% legit. Anti bot systems are a necessary evil. Having these many innocent casualties is not.

The botcheck doesn't have to go. The appeal system is the one that definitely needs work. Claiming that all bans are looked into is a definite untruth. I've not seen a thread where a player got their appeal successful for a botting ban. AriesMS has been successful for a long time, but issues like this can easily blow up when it happens and snowballs. I hope the headmasters can seriously look into a way where appeals are more thoroughly looked at, and whether there is a need to ban players over something trivial just because you can edit the ToS and make your job easier than finding a way to actually help the players with the issues.

The day that legitimate players no longer fear to be banned for not cheating is the day the system is fine. No justice system in the world convicts the innocent and calls it a necessary evil. There are definitely ways we can go about to improve the situation.

No need to write a chunk of text if you can't even comprehend the simple concept of unfairness to other players (that actively play and follow the rules).

The changes were made after much consideration and observation over the YEARS of the issue with Botting.

Regardless, you're entitled to your own opinion.

Regards.