ARK Innocence Scroll 30%

Meews

Member
Nov 15, 2018
61
34
18
Pluto
GMS has ARK Inno scroll option in the enhancement window.
What does it do:
• ARK Inno (30% pass rate) costs 10,000 spelltrace and works like a normal innocence scroll, but keeps the starforce count and the starforce stats.
For example, if you ark inno an 18* item, the 18* star and the stats from starring will stay but the scrolling and slots will be reset.
Why add ARK Inno:
• It will allow rescrolling / mchaosing items even after high starforce *:
- i.e mchaosing a previously Super scrolled item without touching its starforce *
- i.e allowing sweetwater accessory to be mchaosed at 16* w/o wasting Occult scroll. (Since star stays, the m.att/att from 16* will become the base for mchaos)
• It will be a good use of pure meso for spelltrace on top of the existing 30% Inno.
• It is harmless, poses no power creep and only provides scrolling convenience.
 
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Asuka

Member
Jul 20, 2018
52
8
8
The Deepest Level of Hell
Meh, hypothetically, if this were to come out. I would be able to obtain more than enough to never use a single "normal" Innocence Scroll on this server, and without using a single meso (Not just me, a lot of other players as well.)
 

Decency

New member
Jul 31, 2018
8
0
1
sweden
We could customize the price to match the current 40% innocence scroll (14.000 PQ points), so that we at least get an option to choose the one that benefits us the most.
 

Meews

Member
Nov 15, 2018
61
34
18
Pluto
Free spelltrace availability isnt the main contending point for ARK Inno. I'm emphasizing the ability to redo the scrolling at any point of starring. Ark inno pass rate is 30% and costs 2x more than normal 30% inno anyways. In fact ariesms could make ark inno cost 20k spell trace and I still wouldnt mind. The post-starforce scrolling freedom is enough
 

Net

Member
Jul 5, 2019
42
3
8
Canada
The only reason why I oppose this change is because introducing Ark Innocence Scrolls would be completely unfair for those who took the risk and settled on their mchaos rolls before starforcing. Your suggestion is like saying: "yeah, well I don't want to take on that risk anymore"; and that greatly affects how the endgame progression of Aries is supposed to occur. It should be on the players to decide when exactly they're content with the items they scrolled, and not have cop outs in place for them.

Also I'd imagine people trying to exploit easily obtainable starforce early game if they just used spell traces as the cost for it. Why bother planning your gear if you can just fix your mistakes? I think we should be setting the precedent that smarter, prepared players get rewarded better. Furthermore I'd even think that even using PQ points could potentially be too low of a cost.

If it does get implemented, then congratulations, but I think that what we have is fine. The problem that I have with introducing convenience changes in general is that it's been proven time and time again to shaft the older players.
 
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Meews

Member
Nov 15, 2018
61
34
18
Pluto
The scroll's aim is to equalize the order of mchaosing. It would take the same amount of mchaosing at 20* as with at 0* anyways; same 300+ mchaos scrolls and 100+ Innos per item, only difference is order. And no one is stopping previous risk takers to further redo their mchaos with Ark inno either.
What's deferred mchaosing really gonna do, "shaft" people? or gives leeway for scrolling? I believe it is the latter. Your concern is unfounded here.
As for the early game starforcing, do you really think redoing some 12* crappy gears is comparable to an exploit? The whole 100 starforce gate exists for 5th job anyways, what part of the equip set is salvageable, the measly 2 fafnir pieces worth 2b clean?
 

Net

Member
Jul 5, 2019
42
3
8
Canada
Have you ever seen Aries equipment progression videos where players choose to leave their items at 0 starforce because they aren't exactly happy with the way their items are scrolled? The difference in order is exactly what defines the endgame progression for Aries. Starforcing at higher stars is hard. You're supposed to decide when is the right time, and each individual player has a different risk tolerance when it comes to rolling stats. Ergo, it's an investment. You're literally just trying to implement a convenience change and saying: "because it benefits everyone..." without looking at the entire picture. It doesn't matter if your suggestion is popular opinion, because everyone would like it when things become easier. But you need to look at when to change things objectively.

Perhaps the use of the wording exploit is incorrect if your suggestion gets implemented, because by that time it would be a function of the Aries system. But to 100% your Fafnir gear for early starforce, only then to reset it because you were lazy just seems wrong and exploitative to me. It just takes no planning whatsoever, it's like removing the small amount of skill and preparation you need to prepare your gear.

If it does get implemented, then congratulations, but I think that what we have is fine. The problem that I have with introducing convenience changes in general is that it's been proven time and time again to shaft the older players. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
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pumkinkiwi

Member
Apr 9, 2019
37
7
8
Boulder, CO
Have you ever seen Aries equipment progression videos where players choose to leave their items at 0 starforce because they aren't exactly happy with the way their items are scrolled? The difference in order is exactly what defines the endgame progression for Aries. Starforcing at higher stars is hard. You're supposed to decide when is the right time, and each individual player has a different risk tolerance when it comes to rolling stats. Ergo, it's an investment. You're literally just trying to implement a convenience change and saying: "because it benefits everyone..." without looking at the entire picture. It doesn't matter if your suggestion is popular opinion, because everyone would like it when things become easier. But you need to look at when to change things objectively.

Perhaps the use of the wording exploit is incorrect if your suggestion gets implemented, because by that time it would be a function of the Aries system. But to 100% your Fafnir gear for early starforce, only then to reset it because you were lazy just seems wrong and exploitative to me. It just takes no planning whatsoever, it's like removing the small amount of skill and preparation you need to prepare your gear.

If it does get implemented, then congratulations, but I think that what we have is fine. The problem that I have with introducing convenience changes in general is that it's been proven time and time again to shaft the older players. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I don't understand where you are coming from. This is definitely a QoL update that already exists in main servers and it does not affect new or old players differently. Newer players get the freedom to choose how they want to proceed with their gears. Maybe they cant afford the SS or whatever and they just try to fail all slots and star force first like countless players in KMS. Older players can decide to mchaos their gear again because they had to settle for sub-par mchaos due to budget constraints in the past or they really want to go for the best possible mchaos. It allows flexibility and QoL for both end of the spectrum.

And I definitely have left my items at 0 stars because I wasn't happy with my scrolling. Some items like Mesiter, CRA, SoGR almost always require you to mchaos them to truly be an item worthy for end game scenarios. Most people in this state actually just buy a spare meister,CRA,SoGR and mchaos without any starring until they are happy with mchaos and then they star to replace currently equiped item. Your point of starforcing at higher star being hard still remains the same. The difference in order also does not define end game progression in Aries. It has more to do with balancing everything so diminishing return doesn't set in for one particular aspect of your character. Its about upgrading all aspects of your character evenly to get the most efficient values for all of your stats. Giving flexibility on the order and how you want to upgrade these different aspects of your character is a huge win for everyone playing the game and gives you much more flexibility and fresh ideas on gear progression.

The fact that you CAN 100% scroll ur CRA then 12 star just to go back and change the scrolling is exactly the type of planning that you are talking about. That requires much more planning then blindly scrolling everything first and starring. That takes no planning whatsoever. But to mindfully choose which items to scroll first or star first is a much more advanced type of planning needed for Aries. For example, Solid Gollux Ring is a great ring for end game if mchaosed properly. Maybe you are too early in the game to successfully mchaos it so you go with BGS first and star the ring up and you plan on rescrolling the SoGR later once you need the damage boost, have the funds, or etc. Same can be applied with CRAs. Most mid game progression is Super Scrolling these and starring. Late game, it turns into mchaos/super scroll mix. You can have a much better plan of progression if the order of these dont matter and they shouldnt. Then you come back later once you have a decent gear set ready and you rescroll the SoGR or CRA with mchaos. I think this gives a much better idea of "planning your gear" that you mention than just blindly scrolling everything first and then starring just to inno it all away to rescroll and restar.

Just because you struggled through something because you lacked the convenience back then, it doesn't make sense to gimp other players just because you think they should go through the same struggles that you went through when this feature was non-existent. If it affects everyone equally, just be happy that its easier for everyone.